Newbee to the Northwest
Forum Archives
skik9
Posted: Jun-15-2004 at 2:06pm
Hello to all, I have recently moved from New Mexico to the beautiful green, wet, lush, cool climate and oceans of the Northwest. I just bought a home the previous owners didn't landscape and needs my full attention. I will be spending my time reading and learning about this area and gardening. Not only am I new to Oregon, I'm new to gardening. In fact I found this forum when I searched on "google" native plants to Oregon. Lucky me. I saw people with signitures "zone this" and USDA zone that....I have got to get a book. Actully I know about the zones but don't know what my zones are. So I won't bother my fellow gardeners with basic questions. I will be reading and when I get educated I will get more involved. I will ask this...Any good books or web sites for someone like myself? I failed latin in school if you know what I mean.... regards, Kathy
Red Hare
Posted: Jun-15-2004 at 3:07pm
You might want to start with the Sunset Western Garden Book, sort of an encyclopedia of plants. They have their own zone system, with maps in the front of the book.
Ann Lovejoy has a book called "Gardening from Scratch" that would probably be helpful, since she gives a lot of basic information.
This is an especially wonderful place to garden, and a great place to live (if you like the color green!).
Be sure to visit demonstration and community gardens and go on garden tours - you'll get to meet other gardeners and you'll find that they love to share information - and plants! I always learn a lot just browsing through nurseries and reading the tags.
Best of luck to you - have fun!
"A fruit is a vegetable with looks and money. Plus, if you let fruit rot, it turns into wine, something Brussels sprouts never do." - P. J. O'Rourke.
Lisa A
Posted: Jun-15-2004 at 3:24pm
Welcome to Rainy Side and the Pacific Northwest, Kathy!
We've had two relatively recent discussions regarding zones and resources that should help you. See Gary's post, June 5th and my post, June 8th for some helpful links in the discussion called Location, location, location for information regarding Sunset zones and growing conditions.
USDA zone information can be found at the United States National Arboretum site. Click on Oregon for more detailed information. There are some slight differences in the Portland metro area but likely you are USDA zone 8, Sunset zone 6, like me. There are a few areas that for some reason average warmer winters (we call them Banana Belts) or colder due to harsh gorge winds or higher elevations.
Several posters shared s as well as books in the discussion called Resources
Another good place to start is by reading the many helpful articles that Debbie has posted on this . Often she includes links for further information.
Books . . . oh, my, there are so many. You should check out the ones Debbie has included in 's Book Shelf If you are needing basic gardening advice check out Ann Lovejoy's Gardening from Scratch: How To Turn Your Empty Lot Into A Living Garden. I wish this had been available when I started but I still find it useful even though I'm not quite the newbie anymore.
Also, consider joining one of the many wonderful local gardening organizations, such as Hardy Plant Society of Oregon and The Berry Botanic Garden. Membership includes lots of perks, including classes, regularly publications with gardening information. Membership in HPSO includes the opportunity to visit other members' gardens during Open Garden days. This would be a great chance for you to see all the possibilities for your garden. It will make your head spin! LOL
And then there's the many public gardens in the area - Japanese Garden, Chinese Garden, Leach Botanical, Bishop's Close, The Oregon Garden . . . there are more but I'm drawing a blank so hopefully someone else will speak up with other options.
And I didn't even get to nurseries to visit!
You are going to have so much fun!
Gardening in Sunset Zone 6, USDA Zone 8.
Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire. ~ Chinese fortune cookie
skik9
Posted: Jun-15-2004 at 6:20pm
Lisa and Jeannean,
Thank you so much for your advise. I do plan on having some fun with this.
I grew up in Portland. At the time, 20 years ago, I took what this area had to offer for granted. I learned the hard way by moving away to New Mexico. Its a harsh enviroment and very brown.
I am in heaven now and plan to make my very own heaven at home. Wish me luck on my weed pickin' because I have alot of them. Like I said the previous owners of this house really let the weeds take over. The only good I can say about the weeds is they're green!
Again thanks and do members of the forum ever plan "field trips" to any of the gardens around town?
-Kathy
Garden Spider
Posted: Jun-15-2004 at 7:49pm
Welcome to the Forum, Kathy! You're in the same position I am--reclaiming/starting/creating a garden from a neglected collection of weeds! The advice you'll find here is excellent, and the people are wonderful. I've already learned so much from them!
Barb
How she longed to get out of that dark hall and wander about among those beds of bright flowers and those cool fountains. --Lewis Carrol
Lisa A
Posted: Jun-15-2004 at 8:01pm
Kathy, we periodically get together to visit gardens and nurseries. A couple weekends ago, a small group of us went on the A C Gilbert garden tour in Salem (several of us have posted pictures from this tour in the Photo Gallery). Carolyn's garden (one of our members) was on the tour - fabulous garden! This coming weekend a group are going to Victoria, BC for a garden tour (I'm so jealous!).
In past years, we have arranged 2 gatherings a year - one in Washington (the last 3 years it has been the Bainbridge in Bloom garden tour) and one in Oregon (we've had 2 in Portland area, 1 in Salem/Corvallis area). These have generally been well attended with 15 - 25 RS members participating.
Anyone is welcome to plan a gathering. There is a public forum in the Gathering section on this site (further down on the main page) where the gathering is announced and members are invited to participate. We do the planning in private forums (password required) to protect members' privacy and keep tour details off the public page (this is the internet after all, open to all eyes).
And you can always arrange with members to do smaller, less formally planned garden visits. Private messaging is usually the best way to arrange this.
I'm sure you'll find that the mere mention of a garden tour or nursery visit will peak people's interest.
btw, we encourage people to meet in public places if they are meeting for the first time. We do this to protect the whole group as well as any newcomers.
Gardening in Sunset Zone 6, USDA Zone 8.
Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire. ~ Chinese fortune cookie
JeanneK
Posted: Jun-16-2004 at 8:42am
Welcome back to Oregon, Kathy. And welcome to rainyside! There is always lots of good advise on this forum!
I'm in Portland too. Since I live in SE Portland, I get more Gorge winds. Lisa is in more of a banana belt. So depending on where you are in Portland, there may be slightly different conditions.
Since summer is coming on, you might take the summer off and just watch your garden, getting rid of weeds of course, to see what comes up through the year. A lot experts recommend watching the garden for a whole year to get the lay of the land, sun and wind patterns etc. I was forced to wait a year and in hind sight, I think it really helped because I got a much better understanding of my gardens particular conditions.
Have fun and Good luck!
Jeanne
Red Hare
Posted: Jun-17-2004 at 2:29pm
That's good advice, JeanneK, and Kathy can start preparing her soil for planting. She's got time to do the newspaper thing. (Layer several pages of newspaper on the ground, then cover with compost. It will smother the weeds and prepare the soil for planting without a lot of back-breaking effort on your part.) And she can always pick some beauties from the nursery and place them in pots and arrange them by the front door or deck, where they'll be most enjoyed. Fall is the best time to plant so many things anyway, especially shrubs and trees. And if it's as hot and dry this summer as they say it will be, there won't be enough time for plants to become established without lots of watering.
"A fruit is a vegetable with looks and money. Plus, if you let fruit rot, it turns into wine, something Brussels sprouts never do." - P. J. O'Rourke.
Lisa A
Posted: Jun-18-2004 at 8:15am
LOL, Jeanne, I just read your comment that I live in the Banana Belt! While I don't get the gorge winds (what a thing to deal with!) I'm not in the area most local gardeners consider Portland's Banana Belt. IIRC, that area is in inner East-side Portland - Sellwood area and maybe parts of N. Portland (based on a friend's experiences). Gardeners in these areas seem to get more temperate plants to survive the winters than I can. I wonder if soil composition is a factor, too. I seem to recall learning in Master Gardener classes, that due to the Missoula Floods, soils on the West side are heavier soils and on the East side are lighter (more gravelier) and therefore, better draining, which seems to help zonal borderline plants. I remember this difference in soil composition is one of the reasons why downspout disconnect is encouraged on the East side and is more selectively applied on the West side.
Gardening in Sunset Zone 6, USDA Zone 8.
Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire. ~ Chinese fortune cookie
skik9
Posted: Aug-03-2004 at 5:55pm
Sorry it has taken so long to respond to all the great advise. I have finally completely moving into my new house. The sellers created conflict but that's water under the bridge. Another problem I am going to have planting is my property is sloped. I mean like a black diamond ski hill. For those who don't ski that means steep. I am looking for the book Hillside Landscaping by Susan Lang. I went to Barnes and Noble in Beaverton. They didn't have it. They had every book listed on this Forum but that one. I have ordered it. I am interested in find out more about putting newspaper under compost. Is that better then the plastic we used in New Mexico to block out weeds? I was planning to "spring clean my yard" this summer. One of the things I planned to do was put down the "weed block" under barkdust after I clean up the weeds. I need to do some trimming and cutting down a really unslightly tree that blocks my view I just paid for. I want to replace with grass and flowering shubs. Maybe a boulder here and there and ground cover. I am overwelmed with what needs to be done but excited. Thanks agin for all the advise and hopefully I will be able to share my knowledge with a newbe....
JeanneK
Posted: Aug-04-2004 at 8:39am
Hi Kathy,
For steep slopes, you might consider terracing the hill and planting natives. By planting natives, you won't have to water after the second year the plants are in. You can also create a rock garden on the hill. Many plants that like rocky slopes, like well-draining soil or gravel and dry conditions. It will be interesting to see what your Hillside Landscaping book has too say. Alas, I have no slope to speak of. Totally flat!
Don't put plastic down. It doesn't work very well. Rain and water can't get down to the soil. Weeds will find their way in through the plastic. Also, it's hard to move plants around with the plastic, which we all know you will need to move a plant around or two! LOL. And lastly, it is a bear to remove if you want to create a garden out of the area. My back lot was covered with plastic and then bark mulch was placed over the top to prevent weeds. It didn't work and it took days to remove the plastic. Bark and weeds can be quite heavy!
LOL, Lisa, I didn't see your comment earlier. I know you are not in an official banana belt but it seems like it to me! Interesting, I live on 75th, not more than 3 miles from Sellwood, right down Woodstock,Bybee and yet I get gorge winds that put my growth rates a couple weeks behind you, Lisa. Amazing what being close to the river and having a hill to block the winds can do for you, like Sellwood experiences.
Jeanne
Lisa A
Posted: Aug-04-2004 at 9:08am
As Jeanne wrote, plastic is not the way to go, especially with a slope. The water will sheet down the hill, not soak in, carrying the mulch with it and possibly creating drainage issues at the bottom of the slope.
Jeanne, I know what a bear the stuff is, too! We lived in a rental that had this stuff all over the yard. We tried to get grass to grow instead of weeds and discovered it under the mulch and weeds. It had been there long enough to begin to break down and the stuff came up in bits and pieces, making removal difficult. I think that's where my hatred of the stuff began. That said, I did discover that, as a temporary weed block for tough perennial weeds, it has its purpose. We used black plastic in large areas of our garden shortly after we moved in because so much of it was filled with thistle and other horrible weeds. After 3 months, we removed the plastic and 90%-95% of the weeds were gone. That made weeding so much easier for a long time. It was slug heaven, though! Since then, I've learned that clear plastic is the way to go for this method, particularly because black plastic makes a good habitat for carpenter ants, something we don't want to encourage!
Newspaper is cheap and will eventually break down but until then it does a good job of weed blocking. The non-glossy sections of The Oregonian are printed with soy ink so there's no environmental concerns. I reserve landscape cloth for gravel paths and such - places where I won't plant because digging a hole through landscape fabric for a new plant is a pain.
Kathy, we've discussed how to deal with slope in several recent threads. Have you seen those already? There is great information as well as resources that would likely be helpful to you. If you can't find them, I'll give you the links.
Wow, I had no idea that an area that close to Sellwood would still get the gorge wind, Jeanne! Talk about your microclimates.
Gardening in Sunset Zone 6, USDA Zone 8. Education is not the filling of a pail, but the lighting of a fire. ~ Chinese fortune cookie
JeanneK
Posted: Aug-05-2004 at 8:14am
I didn't know that black plastic attracts carpenter ants. That totally explains why we have them!LOL. The elderly lady who lived in our house for the last 90 years was a fanatic (thank god, she was!) for keeping the place up and I couldn't believe she'd live with ants. The house sat empty for 5-6 months through the summer. Wonder if that is when they accumulated.
Yeah, microclimates are an interesting thing! That's another reason to go slow in converting over your property to gardens. Know where your windy and cold spots along with hot spots are. DH and I have noticed will coming home from Downtown Portland that the temperature increases at least 2 deg. F when coming through SE Portland until we hit the hill after 39th and 52nd and then it drops down 2-3 deg. Probably also attributed to more concrete.
Pulling up the plastic in large pieces is much better although heavy than getting little snippets. You don't know whether you've got it all. Boy, what a nightmare you'd have putting black plastic on a slope!
Jeanne
Sydnie
Posted: Aug-10-2004 at 12:27pm
Hi Kathy-
I wish I'd of had this site 10 yrs ago when I started. All the people are extremely helpful and full of knowlege. (as I'm sure you see!) Welcome to Rainyside!
I live on a hill- Everyone's idea's and suggestions are great!!! Everything will dry out even faster than normal. Just remember the 'flatter' you make the spot- and the more rocks and such you use- the better it will hold water. Another words- terracing like Jeanne is talking about is an excellent way to go. I love rocks and things like that here. I didn't do this when I started and have spent a lot of time and effort redoing and- oh my- watering...... Of course watering systems added might be a consideration, too. I like the native idea, esp. They do so much better in 'dry' summers, once they've established- better than non-natives. I also did raised beds. Those dry out ten times as fast on this hill. Esp. until they are well established. I don't do raised anymore and have removed some that I did do. Even on the flats here the drainage is incredible. No wet feet rotting here. LOL.
Good luck with your projects!!!
Gardening for the Homebrewer: Grow and Process Plants for Making Beer, Wine, Gruit, Cider, Perry, and More
By co-authors Debbie Teashon (Rainy Side Gardeners) and Wendy Tweton